To all you....
Moderator: RLG MGMT Team
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
True, a repeal of the 2nd Amendment would take a two-thirds majority in Congress to pass and I really dont think that would happen.Gator wrote: I'm less worried about losing the 2nd amendment. It's not easy to change the constitution.
I have learned from experience that a modicum of snuff can be most efficacious - Baron Munchausen
I guess my point was that the national trend is not going in that direction (at least as far as I can see). However, I'm in VA where the firearms laws are relatively loose (heck, the HQ of the NRA is down the street from my house) compared with yours in CA. Just this last year in DC, the Supreme Court just struck down their handgun ban.
Silence is golden - Duct Tape is silver
Panz, there is a difference in avoiding questions and being snarky. McCain has been consistently insulting and sophomoric in his addresses during the debates. As for Obama's education plan. I'll get back to you when I have more time, perhaps this weekend. Right now, I have to write a parent and let him know why his child is a f*#(!-up. I like this discussion here. The comments are insightful, intelligent, and respectful. I wonder why the two candidates can't do what we're doing here? Oh well, guess it's a pipe-dream.
i know about the supreme court ruling. that gave the NRA, et al the impetus to take a lot of other laws to court. yes, CA is pretty restrictive and they come up with stupider (sorry Grif!) things all the time. like making license checks (or something like that) for FFL holders to ship firearms to other FFL holders. extra paperwork, fees, etc. anything they can to hinder firearms commerce. they are going to try and start telling you what kind of ammunition you can own/buy/shoot as well - lead free. and our damn Governor, supposed to be a Republican, actually signed the firearm shipping thing into law. He just called himself a Republican to get the votes.
But I am serious about the big brother thing and the 2nd amendment. if the government owns the banks...what can they do with that information?
But I am serious about the big brother thing and the 2nd amendment. if the government owns the banks...what can they do with that information?
Helmut
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
-
Jedi Master
- Posts: 1364
- Joined: 11 Feb 2004, 14:32
- Location: Melbourne, FL
The 2nd Amendment becomes moot if no one can AFFORD a gun, or have anywhere to keep them!
We might as well push thru a 30th Amendment for the right to own land on Jupiter for all the difference it will make.
The point is our gov't has become Socialist for the rich. They're allowed to do whatever they want and step on whoever they want to make megabucks for themselves, and if they screw it all up they moan and whine for Mommy Gov't to save them or they threaten to take the whole country down with them. Those of us who did nothing wrong but try to make an honest living can either go to hell or pay to prop them up.
What a choice.
Of course, my favorite bit is when they ask "are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?" Well, yes and no. The yes is because of stuff _I_ did that the gov't did nothing to affect. The no is pretty much because of everything the gov't DID do (or failed to do). However, I can say that with confidence for EVERY administration that has existed since my birth. So, as far as I'm concerned both parties should be disbanded and new ones should be formed with a minimum of 3 equally sized ones if not more.
I'm not a gun-masturbating, swear-averse, sex-is-evil, gays-are-Satan, kill-all-commies/muslims/chinese, anything-for-the-rich, screw-the-poor, whack job living in a log cabin reminiscing about the days before the Civil War like I remember them personally.
I'm also not gun-hating, let's-make-everyone-gay, anything-goes-in-art, love-all-commies/muslims/chinese, anything-for-the-poor, screw-the-rich, nutter living in a loft in a big city drinking overpriced coffee and talking about how the Man keeps the people down.
I HATE both of those groups equally. I want a Center party. If you think the Republicans are too far right and Democrats are too far left, you should be with me in the center!!
We might as well push thru a 30th Amendment for the right to own land on Jupiter for all the difference it will make.
The point is our gov't has become Socialist for the rich. They're allowed to do whatever they want and step on whoever they want to make megabucks for themselves, and if they screw it all up they moan and whine for Mommy Gov't to save them or they threaten to take the whole country down with them. Those of us who did nothing wrong but try to make an honest living can either go to hell or pay to prop them up.
What a choice.
Of course, my favorite bit is when they ask "are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?" Well, yes and no. The yes is because of stuff _I_ did that the gov't did nothing to affect. The no is pretty much because of everything the gov't DID do (or failed to do). However, I can say that with confidence for EVERY administration that has existed since my birth. So, as far as I'm concerned both parties should be disbanded and new ones should be formed with a minimum of 3 equally sized ones if not more.
I'm not a gun-masturbating, swear-averse, sex-is-evil, gays-are-Satan, kill-all-commies/muslims/chinese, anything-for-the-rich, screw-the-poor, whack job living in a log cabin reminiscing about the days before the Civil War like I remember them personally.
I'm also not gun-hating, let's-make-everyone-gay, anything-goes-in-art, love-all-commies/muslims/chinese, anything-for-the-poor, screw-the-rich, nutter living in a loft in a big city drinking overpriced coffee and talking about how the Man keeps the people down.
I HATE both of those groups equally. I want a Center party. If you think the Republicans are too far right and Democrats are too far left, you should be with me in the center!!
The Jedi Master
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
Well, the "Center" in the US is essentially composed of the Independent voters on the citizen side and liberal Republicans and conservative Democrats on the politician side. The fact is that there is a real Center in the US. Why else do you think McCain and Obama have both gravitated towards the center so they can get more votes?
I have learned from experience that a modicum of snuff can be most efficacious - Baron Munchausen
-
Tach Deneva
- Posts: 1546
- Joined: 18 Dec 2002, 18:51
- Location: KY
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
What's funny is what you described here would be considered "center" and mainstream in Europe.Jedi Master wrote: I'm also not gun-hating, let's-make-everyone-gay, anything-goes-in-art, love-all-commies/muslims/chinese, anything-for-the-poor, screw-the-rich, nutter living in a loft in a big city drinking overpriced coffee and talking about how the Man keeps the people down.
I have learned from experience that a modicum of snuff can be most efficacious - Baron Munchausen
Panzer,
Here is my response to your query about Obama and McCain's education policy and why I will be voting for Obama instead of McCain. Before I do so, however, I have to say that I'm very disappointed to have found that neither politician had a proper platform statement on their websites. In years past, presidential elects were very good about providing very detailed platform statements on their websites so that voters could really read what the candidates stood for. Apparently, our culture has grown too impatient for such detailed statements, or the candidates feel that we can't handle the details, or neither one has delved too deeply into the issues and has a well-thought out solution to the problems.
Instead, their platforms read more like mission outlines; nevertheless, Obama's statements on education were far more compelling because he employs the vernacular of educators and at least hints at some sense of how he intends to solve the problems. There is also some suggestion that he will work with teachers in resolving these issues rather than just create policy.
McCain's solution seems looser and read more like slogans rather than tangible strategies to resolve educational issues. There is an emphasis on student accountability through standardized exams. You can read the research on standard exams at your leisure if you so desire. They have their merits and drawbacks, but they should not be the basis for defining an educational vision.
There are rewards for teachers who work in bad school systems but apparently little to no reward for those who work hard in good systems.
Also, there is an emphasis on the Virtual Learning program, a program that I've seen first hand and I know does not work. It's smoke and mirrors. These programs often lack genuine substance.
Finally, there appears to be implied in McCain's policy the status quo of laying more and more responsibility and accountability on the backs of teachers while at the same time "empowering" parents to send their kids to other school districts. The focus is misguided here. Instead of improving the community and school district into a place where good teachers would want to go and work, McCain wants to bribe good teachers to work in hostile environments.
His education policy is too broad and focused on giving students the opportunity to learn elsewhere, either through virtual learning or attending another district, rather than working on improving the troubled district in question. But don't listen to me. Below I've listed both candidates' education policies. Read them for yourself!
Here's McCain's:
http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/New ... f35e68c0d4
Here's Obama's
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/education/
Here is my response to your query about Obama and McCain's education policy and why I will be voting for Obama instead of McCain. Before I do so, however, I have to say that I'm very disappointed to have found that neither politician had a proper platform statement on their websites. In years past, presidential elects were very good about providing very detailed platform statements on their websites so that voters could really read what the candidates stood for. Apparently, our culture has grown too impatient for such detailed statements, or the candidates feel that we can't handle the details, or neither one has delved too deeply into the issues and has a well-thought out solution to the problems.
Instead, their platforms read more like mission outlines; nevertheless, Obama's statements on education were far more compelling because he employs the vernacular of educators and at least hints at some sense of how he intends to solve the problems. There is also some suggestion that he will work with teachers in resolving these issues rather than just create policy.
McCain's solution seems looser and read more like slogans rather than tangible strategies to resolve educational issues. There is an emphasis on student accountability through standardized exams. You can read the research on standard exams at your leisure if you so desire. They have their merits and drawbacks, but they should not be the basis for defining an educational vision.
There are rewards for teachers who work in bad school systems but apparently little to no reward for those who work hard in good systems.
Also, there is an emphasis on the Virtual Learning program, a program that I've seen first hand and I know does not work. It's smoke and mirrors. These programs often lack genuine substance.
Finally, there appears to be implied in McCain's policy the status quo of laying more and more responsibility and accountability on the backs of teachers while at the same time "empowering" parents to send their kids to other school districts. The focus is misguided here. Instead of improving the community and school district into a place where good teachers would want to go and work, McCain wants to bribe good teachers to work in hostile environments.
His education policy is too broad and focused on giving students the opportunity to learn elsewhere, either through virtual learning or attending another district, rather than working on improving the troubled district in question. But don't listen to me. Below I've listed both candidates' education policies. Read them for yourself!
Here's McCain's:
http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/New ... f35e68c0d4
Here's Obama's
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/education/
Jedi consider yourself on a list, I don't know what that list is but after that post consider yourself on it and in a minute I will be joining you. Grif I still can't wrap my head around the fact that we are willing to allow Sports Figures to own our children's heart and pay them mega millions and keep the men and women who give everything to make sure our children are ready to go out in the world in poverty. Its a dayum shame I tell you a damn shame. I SAY DOWN WITH THE ESTABLISHMENT!!!!!!!!
DA
DA
Grim Diablo, Grand Admiral, Erebus System Survey Group
Death Angel, SGT, 13th MEU
Death Angel, SGT, 13th MEU
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
Well you see, the fundamental question to ask before entering this kind of debate is whether or not the federal government should even be involved in public education. My personal belief is that it shouldn't. Everything from policies, training and funding should be left up to the individual States.Grifter wrote: http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/New ... f35e68c0d4
Here's Obama's
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/education/
I have learned from experience that a modicum of snuff can be most efficacious - Baron Munchausen
-
PanzerMeyer
- Posts: 4795
- Joined: 10 Feb 2004, 08:54
- Location: Miami, Florida
"No Child Left Behind" never made sense to me and I was never in favor of it. So much for Republicans wanting smaller government huh? LOLGator wrote:I agree - the fed never got involved much until "no child left behind" ... i remember education was always county/state. I recall my mother hated it when that bill went into effect. Waaay too many regulations/requirements.
And yeah, I am a Republican but that doesn't mean I cant criticize my own party when they stray from the truth and the light.
I have learned from experience that a modicum of snuff can be most efficacious - Baron Munchausen
Yeah but Panzer that's no longer the issue. Look, I don't like NCLB...you're absolutely right, it's just plain wrong, in theory and in practice. As it is written, it actually hinders rather than helps education. But the fact is that it's here and it's not likely to be repealed anytime soon. No, the real issue, at least for me, is who are we going to put into office to address problems in education as it stands today, which includes NCLB policy. Obama clearly addresses NLCB and claims that he will work with educational professionals to modify the current law so that it makes, at the very least, some sort of sense. I don't see this claim in McCain's "policy." Again, I urge you to read their plans to improve education, if you have not already done so, and decide for yourself. For me, all of the issues are important, but this one puts bread on my table and clothes on my back. So, for me, this issue is paramount. As always, I urge all here to vote with their informed conscience. In these desperate times I don't think it would be overstating to invoke Murrow's famous "Good Night and Good Luck" for us all.