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Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 11:31**

For those of you that play with me, you know by now I've been havign a great deal of computer trouble.

Problem: the computer "Freezes" or "Locks up" mid game. With this locking up, the sound repeats itself in a machine gun like manner, repeating the last sound over and over at a high rate. Only option is to hit the reset button on the case.

Possible causes that have been suggested-

overheat: My computer is rated to run between 0-85C. I was just testing it and it was getting as high as 58C. The strain on the graphics card was moderate, not very high during this test. (IL2 out in the middle of nowhere, no city, but numerous combatants).

Power Supply- the Soyo kt 600 Ultra mobo needs 350 watts to run minimum. I think that is what I'm running for a power supply, but it's been so long I'm just unsure. I'm uncertain as to how to check this. I've looked for labels on the power supply itself and found nothing except a warranty sticker marked year 2002. At least it seems it's not the same PS I was running my p150 on. Should I upgrade? See system config below.

Sound card: I have a Sound Blaster Live. It's old but never given me trouble. Perhaps this is the case? Need a new one?

Here are my system specs in brief:

Soyo KT600 Ultra Platinum Edition MOBO.
Athlon XP 3200+
640MB Ram
ATI Radeon 9500 Pro
Sound Blaster LIVE Card.
TWO Hardrives. I only use the secondary for storage.
TOSHIBA CD-ROM XM-5602B
TEAC CDRW= TEAC CD-W54E

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 12:27**

My first instinct is still to lean toward you having an overheating problem. Either the CPU or the GPU (I would lean toward the GPU). However, I would surmise it's just a symptom of the whole system being warm. I know you've worked with adding fans, etc ... so if you think there's enough exhaust, there's not much else on that front.

On the other hand, power supplies are notorious for degrading over time and if the power coming out isn't steady/clean, it can manifest itself in ways that don't seem power related. If it's a 350W from 2002, you'd probably benefit from a 400W or so from 2006. All those hard drives, optical drives and the big proc are a big draw. You could just be riding a tired horse of a PSU. They are easy to replace, but you want to make sure you buy a good one. I usually look for ones with a fan/vent/intake on the "bottom" (this isn't a given -- you have to look for this) plus the one that they all have on the "back." Coolermaster and Antec are good bets in my recollection.

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 12:36**

I don't suppose you're experiencing any particular beeps at start-up which might help tell you there's anything wrong? I'm guessing you have already had a look at the device manager too and found nothing. But given that it only happens over a period of time, does indicate a heat problem. The simplest suggestion I can offer is to try replacing each item one by one, putting it back if you don't have any luck. Once that is done, you can do it in a block replacement method, placing your suspect items into the known good system until the problem appears again - this allows you to eliminate good items, and look at the possibility of several items causing the problem together. Thinking about your PSU, I'd say that it should be good enough @ 350W. But the real question is how hard is it straining to give you that output? And do you have indication of the fan in the PSU rotating? If you have installed any fans, are they blowing in the correct direction? Just some more thoughts to keep you going mate. Best of luck.

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 12:43**

I really haven't installed any new fans. I've thought about it. but have tried living with this problem until I could be sure that it was indeed a heat prob. Perhaps I should get new fans and a new PSU and just install them and see if that helps. I'll post pics of my comps internals here.

how bout this computer PSU?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817103932

This what I need?

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 12:51**

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 13:21**

Just put a huge box fan near my pc and lowered its' idle temp from 52c to 44 c cpu and 27 to 23 C on the Chassis. hmm.

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 14:39**

That PSU is one of the good ones ... read the reviews to make sure there're no suprises.

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 16:39**

Then get a second opinion from somewhere like Tom's Hardware.

Posted: **18 Mar 2006, 19:11**

does the fan inside the housing in pic 21 function? it is blowing air into the case, right?

you have a tangled mass behind your drives/drive cages - you should try and sort the wires and cables neatly and open that area up for airflow as much as possible.

your power supply fan functions?

your cpu fan functions?

your graphics card fan functions?

you need to close up the two empty slots on the bottom of the case where add in cards would go - unless you pulled your sound card for pic taking... if so, don't leave any open when you put it back in - all slot covers are to be in place. don't place two cards next to eaxh other down there at the bottom - spread them out with at least one slot between them.

i have a power supply for you...430 watt. we use a seasonic at work for our high end workstations - quieter that the antecs and more power and more efficient. not sure of cost though. i would not drop a large sum on cash (i.e. that high end of a power supply) on that rig. do you intend to upgrade it? if you do, you need to make sure that the power supply you do get has power connectors for what you have now and for upgrades in the future. you will undoutedly need a new case for your next setup - it has no spot for supplementary fans on tha back of the case...which would be the first thing i would recommend - but you can't.

in this case (pun?) you are going to have to decide between tryng to rig things up to work in this case or get a new case that has more cooling capability. you can make this one work with blowers like you have and there are cooling fans that you can put in the 5.25" bays in the front of the case, maybe beef up the fan at the bottom front as well. but this adds up to noise...

can you take that blower and get it to turn upside down in its bracket, then put it under the video card?

a better fan in the power supply will help, but they are sometimes tricky to swap out.

you can check your power supply better for labels if you remove it. there are 4 screws on the back of the case holding it in. remove them and you can probably remove it enough to look at a label that is probably hidden right now, without disconnecting all of the power leads from the drives, mainboard, etc.

your cpu will draw 76 watts at max - that power supply should be o.k. if it is 350...but that could be the issus as well. when did all this start? it has been going on for a while. something must have gotten all this started...something was added or changed?

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 00:06**

To get a true indication as to what is happening within the case, it is important to close it off correctly, and observe where possible, temperatures of all critical locations. Having the case open may 'help' keep the PC cool , but is only masking the problem. And it will be more difficult to spot.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 08:47**

does the fan inside the housing in pic 21 function? it is blowing air into the case, right?

Yes it functions.

you have a tangled mass behind your drives/drive cages - you should try and sort the wires and cables neatly and open that area up for airflow as much as possible.

Believe me I've tried. Though I could give it another go.

your power supply fan functions?

your cpu fan functions?

your graphics card fan functions?

Yes to all.

you need to close up the two empty slots on the bottom of the case where add in cards would go - unless you pulled your sound card for pic taking... if so, don't leave any open when you put it back in - all slot covers are to be in place. don't place two cards next to eaxh other down there at the bottom - spread them out with at least one slot between them.

Yes, I had removed the sound card to reseat it. I took out a television jack because I don't use it. I need to gtet a metal punchout tab to close it up.

i have a power supply for you...430 watt. we use a seasonic at work for our high end workstations - quieter that the antecs and more power and more efficient. not sure of cost though.

funny Gerry mentioned the same compnay. I will go take a look at them and see what I can get for the money.

i would not drop a large sum on cash (i.e. that high end of a power supply) on that rig. do you intend to upgrade it?

I plan on maintaining this rig as long as possible. I have no funds to replace it.

can you take that blower and get it to turn upside down in its bracket, then put it under the video card?

The ATI Card's fan is on the bottom drawin air in I think. We've discussed this and you suggested this rig to maximize bleeding the heat off.

you will undoutedly need a new case for your next setup - it has no spot for supplementary fans on tha back of the case...which would be the first thing i would recommend - but you can't.

So the best answer would be to replace the power supply and buy a new case with new fans so that I have plenty of room and plenty of cooling etc etc.? If so, Gerry agreed to help me do a rebuild. I might be able to get the parts and go from there. In the meantime, I think we're absolutely certian it's a heat problem now. I'm going to keep the box fan on it when we play games. I'm almost certain that will help until I can get this sucker squared away. I really should take some computer fix it course so that I can fix my own machine, swap out mobos etc....I don't have the skills and I'm too scared of breaking my own stuff.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 08:51**

Oh yeah, if anyone can post suggestions, with links if you wouldn't mind, here for computer cases, fans, and power supplies, I would be grateful. Thanks gang.

Steel I'm sure the seasonic will work great, but that antec was aweful tempting because when I finally do switch out mobos/cpus etc, I might have the power necessary to compensate for it. Or is it just plain overkill and really not worth the money.

Steel, unscrewed my PSU from the frame.. I must've bought it for this comp...stupid, I must have went on the cheap end because it's only 350w. So I'll have to upgrade it.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 11:28**

http://www.mofocases.com/
http://www.caseking.de/
http://www.coolerguys.com/index.html
http://www.dangerden.com/
http://www.gruntville.com/
http://www.raptor-mods.co.uk/index.php?home
http://www.cuttingedgecasemods.com/
http://www.ultraproducts.com/
http://www.voyeurmods.com/
http://www.webtechgeek.com/index.html
http://www.thermaltake.com/

Hope that gives you some food for thought mate.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 12:38**

Uhm...do I need an ATX case or a BTX?

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 12:49**

That will depend really on what you have as components. But if you are still going to be running the rig you have now, then an ATX case is fine.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 12:55**

BTX is a new style and you would need a BTX motherboard for it. If you want a case for your current rig, ATX is all you can do. I would recommend a tower or one of the larger style cases. I had heating trouble and without changing fans or anything, the larger case lowered the temp (better cable routing, airflow, etc). Plus, it's easier to work inside a larger case.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 13:17**

Ok, so I need to buy some stuff. No frills necessary. I just want it to function properly. I want to do it as cheaply as possible of course, but I want to do the job RIGHT. I don't want to have to deal with this crap anymore once I've gone through the headache of fixing this problem. Any suggestions or help is welcomed. Thanks guys. I'm going to supply a list here of potentials buys and hoping you'll get back to me with some advise on what to purchase. But, before I do that, here is my essential rig components again-

Soyo KT600 Ultra Platinum Edition MOBO.
Athlon XP 3200+
640MB Ram
ATI Radeon 9500 Pro
Sound Blaster LIVE Card.
TWO Hardrives. I only use the secondary for storage.
TOSHIBA CD-ROM XM-5602B
TEAC CDRW= TEAC CD-W54E
Firewire 3.5" housed in front of case USB PORTS AND SUCH HERE

1. I need a new case that will maximize air flow and cooling. Take a look at the pictures of my case here on this forum. It's a crowded, jumbled mess that reduces air flow and increases HEAT!!!

I have firewire kit in the front of my comp 3.5" space I need to intall as well. I need at least one usb in the back I think. I could probably use a case that comes with fans?

According to Soyo I have an ATX Mobo if I'm reading his right: "SY-KT600 DRAGON PLUS (discontinued)
AMD Socket-A AthlonXP, Athlon & Duron Based VIA KT600 Chipset ATX Motherboard Supporting 400 MHz FSB, DDR400/333, 6-ch audio, 8X AGP, overclock capability, Anti-Burn Regulator, 10/100 Mbps LAN, USB 2.0, Serial ATA, IEEE 1394" So I'm assuming the list I put below here may be close to what I need. Maybe you guys have something better in mind than what you see here.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811144164 This is a full tower, not sure I want this one because it comes w/ psu etc. probably crappy psu and fans. but the space.....hmm.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811163030 ????

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811112022

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811196011

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811129173

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811133146

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811133142

Do any of these suit my needs? Do you guys have any better recommendations? Here's the list of all mid tower cases from new egg below. They are 100 bucks or less. I don't think I would need to spend anymore on a case.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductLi ... geSize=100 The whole list of mid tower cases from new egg.

2. Fans and heatsinks? I HAVE NO IDEA!!!! HELP. Since sound is not a major concern to me, the cooler I can get this sucker the better. 120mm fan? What the hell do the heatsinks do and where do they go?

3. A new power supply. Currently I am only using a 350W. power supply. Thing is, I'm kinda unsure how many connectors, and what kind of connectors I'll need?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817103932 Antec This one overkill? 107 reviews. Top one says it died in a few days?!!!

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817103937 Antec 117 reviews...most positive.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817171006 CoolerMaster This one overkill?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817171005 CoolerMaster Probably enough power.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817151024 Seasonic This the company you were talking about?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817151023 Seasonic.

If none of these fit my system, maybe you could suggest something?

Any suggestions or combo of suggestions would be welcomed thanks. PS I have no idea what I'm doing, thanks.

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 14:20**

the first one is deinitely not no frills...it has all kinds of extra crap you don't need. you may not like the door that closes on the front blocking access and requiring you to open the door to access cdroms, floppy, your media kit, etc. that is my biggest beef about cases like that...you might like closing the door though.

the second one is a nice case - functional, has a spot on the back for a 120mm fan - which means a quiet fan (the larger the fans are the slower they can spin and move the same volume of air). kinda pricey though.

same with the third case...plus it has venting out the top.

the fourth is quite interesting. uses the same type of design that the Lian Li case we use for our high end workstations has - power supply at the bottom and the mainboard flipped around (BTW - this makes it BTX-like...). plus you can connect as many or as few of the fans on the side panel as you like.

i would avoid the 5th one - the Antec, unless you can find pics of the inside somewhere else.

the 6th one is ummm, interesting. it would work if you like it. the good thing it is comes with the 120mm fan on the back and is cheaper.

same with the 7th.

out of all of them i would pick the 4th one first, then between the 2nd and 3rd. where are you going to put the computer after you change the case? make sure you take the size of the new case into account.

leave your heatsink alone... depending upon the case you get, you will need either 80mm or 120mm fan(s). it should come with at least the front fan that blows into the case. as you see, some come with the back fan as well.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835185021

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835129242

just search for "fans" - you will get some other results mixed in. look for at leat 30cfm and a db rating of lower than 30, preferably under 25.

something like this instead of that blower (since it sounds like you can not flip it over) would move the air away from your video card:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835888112

any of those power supplies will fit. yes, that is the company i am talking about. i would suggest the two seasonics - the 430 is enough, the 500 should be good for future upgrade. the one we use is the Seasonic SS-600HT.

i have a couple of power supplies for you if you want. maybe can dig up a decent case as well. also remember that you can't stick it into a enclosed cubby. you should at least open the back of that cubhole up so hot air can exhaust (i seem to recall the desk is enclosed on the back with some type of backboard).

for now, i would open the case up, and blow either a small personal fan (with the clip so you can mount it anywhere) or a regular house fan onto the unit - not in the cubhole.

next step - get a case and appropriate number of cooling fans (back and front). do the power supply last as a seperate purchase as it may not really be an issue.

them be my suggestions...

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 14:33**

The comp is on the floor now...There is still a back behind it but there is more breathing room down there. All the heat/fan tests were done in this position. :-) So I think I'm cool.

Thanks for the suggestions. Any suggestions on what fan(s) I should buy assuming that I'm buying the 4th case? do I need a fan in the front with that case? (BTW, I liked that one a lot too).

Posted: **19 Mar 2006, 14:40**

check my post - i edited a couple in.

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Grifter's ongoing comp trouble

Grifter's ongoing comp trouble